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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 4:16 pm 
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Those shocks appear to be Pro Shocks:

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Shop/Pro- ... ies/4.html

Which are now under the Afco umbrella:

http://www.afcodynapro.com/proshocks

The tell-tall marking is the "M" "S" "F" for medium, soft and firm setting.

I had considered on using them at one point, but ended up buying QA1's.

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 5:06 pm 
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The Coleman R&P stamping "1.8" on the cover plate means an 18:1 ratio. If this isn't fast enough, you can just replace the pinion and some bushings (about $50). The other ratios are 16:1, 12:1 and 8:1. The part number on the bottom is just the housing number, should it need to be replaced.


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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 5:27 pm 
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And speaking of high stress areas, they necked down the bolts on the front control arms to use 3/8" bolts. The rear uses 1/2". To my way of thinking there are more stresses on the front. Am I wrong?

You can see the steel insert sticking out the side of the heim in this picture. This is going to make for some interesting noises and vibrations.

Attachment:
IMG_7647.jpg
IMG_7647.jpg [ 175.28 KiB | Viewed 5245 times ]


And I've got to figure out some sort of spacers to use in there that won't interfere with the heim movement. Of course the good thing is that in theory it shouldn't have any off axis movement.

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Last edited by carguy123 on October 8, 2014, 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 5:30 pm 
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seven13bt wrote:
The Coleman R&P stamping "1.8" on the cover plate means an 18:1 ratio. If this isn't fast enough, you can just replace the pinion and some bushings (about $50). The other ratios are 16:1, 12:1 and 8:1. The part number on the bottom is just the housing number, should it need to be replaced.


So that means I got the fastest ratio or the slowest?

I'd bet slowest since they don't want any quick movements on the salt flats.

Slow is smooth, as long as it isn't too slow.

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Last edited by carguy123 on October 8, 2014, 7:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 5:38 pm 
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You are correct. It's the slowest. It should be fine to start with, but you probably wouldn't want to go any faster than the 16:1, unless it's just going to be a track car.


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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 8:02 pm 
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And speaking of high stress areas, they necked down the bolts on the front control arms to use 3/8" bolts.


Without commenting on the suitability in your case, this is all common practice. You can buy those reducer sleeves for rod ends from all the common suppliers. You could think of it as a bearing upgrade for more life. The 3/8" bolt is good for many thousands of pounds in shear, i think over 8000 for a grade 5 bolt. It's also installed in double shear. You could loctite the sleeves into the bearing if your worried about NVH. You can also buy spacers of various sizes to fill the gap or use washers. This is where having a lathe lets you do a little routine piece of fabrication that is typical of a well maintained race car and frustrating if you just don't have simple shop tools.

It's good you're going thru this stuff and checking everything. A good looking car can hide a bunch of nasty secrets when you get into it. Some of them can hurt you, so that's why it's good you're doing this.

You shouldn't be having those issues with the bellcranks hitting the shocks and the pushrod hitting the frame when the car is just jacked up. It looks like you could lower the spring perches and lengthen the pushrods. The bellcranks will still rest on the frame when the car is jacked up but they won't hit the frame and the shock should easily fit into it's mount. It's OK for the springs to be loose at full droop, but they shouldn't be so loose that if the car goes airborne the springs fail to seat into the collar at the top of the coilover. On my race car the springs are tie wrapped to the upper collar to prevent that. You have to drill little holes in the collar for that.

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 10:13 pm 
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And that's why I'm going over it with a fine toothed comb. I haven't had to think through all the little details so I don't know what their trade offs were or if there are even areas that have issues.

I began being worried about choices the previous owner might have made and it's led into things not necessarily done wrong, but done differently than is important to me.

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 10:51 pm 
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carguy123 wrote:
seven13bt wrote:
The Coleman R&P stamping "1.8" on the cover plate means an 18:1 ratio. If this isn't fast enough, you can just replace the pinion and some bushings (about $50). The other ratios are 16:1, 12:1 and 8:1. The part number on the bottom is just the housing number, should it need to be replaced.


So that means I got the fastest ratio or the slowest?
It all depends. The installed steering ratio for your car is affected by the steering arm length used and other spindle geometry. A better reference measurement is the number of inches the rack travels for one full turn of the pinion shaft. This can be easily measured.

To get the steering ratio on your car, set things up to measure how many degrees the front wheels turn for one full turn of the pinion shaft (or steering wheel if no quickener is installed.) As an example, if a full 360* turn of the pinion shaft resulted in a 25 degree turn of the front wheels, then your steering ratio would be 360/25 or 14.4:1. If you have all the x, y, z coordinates, Wishbone will calculate the wheel angle for you, based on steering rack movement.

But hey, that is a nice rack 8)

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 8, 2014, 11:34 pm 
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I told my wife that every one said I had a nice rack and she said I used to.

I'm not sure what she's talking about but I think she just cut me big time.

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 9, 2014, 12:49 am 
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carguy123 wrote:
I told my wife that every one said I had a nice rack and she said I used to.

I'm not sure what she's talking about but I think she just cut me big time.
Hope she wasn't referring to rack travel... :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 9, 2014, 7:47 am 
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seattletom wrote:
carguy123 wrote:
I told my wife that every one said I had a nice rack and she said I used to.

I'm not sure what she's talking about but I think she just cut me big time.
Hope she wasn't referring to rack travel... :mrgreen:

Is that the same as "droop" that we all talk about???

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 9, 2014, 9:23 am 
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You guys are just cruel (or jealous if you've been window peeping), but I'll forgive you and give you this shot of the adapter they used on the top of the Miata upright to attach a heim joint. It's not tightened down yet. I don't have anything tightened to full spec on the suspension yet.

The bottom uses a ball joint and at the moment the cotter pin interferes with the bottom of the shock push rod.

Now I just need to find me some of those cone shaped spacers in different lengths, since I don't have a lathe, so that I can assemble the rest of the suspension properly.


Attachments:
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IMG_7646.jpg [ 145.79 KiB | Viewed 5188 times ]
IMG_7650.jpg
IMG_7650.jpg [ 169.33 KiB | Viewed 5188 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 9, 2014, 9:58 am 
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Everybody sells the spacers and reducers. Consider installing that cotter pin and see if it still fouls? It need to be pushed in until the loop part is in the castle...

The good brackets like the one on your wishbone come a sleeve welded to one side and a slide on sleeve for the other side.

So the M-SPec comes with Miata uprights instead of S10?

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 9, 2014, 10:48 am 
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As I said the suspension is just on there loosely until I can quit taking it apart so many times. I may be able to tighten the nut slightly and the cotter pin isn't seated completely, but that does highlight a potential trouble spot as if it does work loose and then get rubbed in half by contact with the push rod then it might fall out and the nut would be able to back itself out. Just one more item to work on to eliminate possible future probs.

I don't understand what you mean by "The good brackets like the one on your wishbone come a sleeve welded to one side and a slide on sleeve for the other side." Got a pic or a link?

And yes my M Spec uses Miata spindles, although they've now changed to a custom upright.

And for your edification, they use 14 gauge, 1 1/4" tubing mostly.

I'm not to the point of actually buying any spacers or adapters because I'm not sure everything is going to stay exactly like it is, but it's good to know I shouldn't have any difficulty finding them when I need them.

Smiley's circle track supplier has a location about an hour and a half from my house and one day I need to go over there and just see what's available off the shelf. I might find all kinds of things I can't live without and that will make my life easier. Fortunately I can get all the blow up dolls I need much closer to home.

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 Post subject: Re: STALKER -ish build
PostPosted: October 9, 2014, 1:07 pm 
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Quote:
I don't understand what you mean by "The good brackets like the one on your wishbone come a sleeve welded to one side and a slide on sleeve for the other side." Got a pic or a link?


Here ya go-
Attachment:
Shock Mount.jpg
Shock Mount.jpg [ 47.78 KiB | Viewed 5164 times ]
The welded sleeve in in the mount (duh) and the slider is the piece lying beside the mount.
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/AFCO-Weld-On-Universal-Shock-Mount-Narrow,26268.html

The slider allows for different thicknesses of shock ends. You can get them in two widths, and with flat bottoms on the bracket or rounded ones depending on what you're welding it to.

I used several of them on the Slotus, for the coilovers and for mounting heim-jointed ends of control arms. Very handy little widgets!

:cheers:
JDK

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"Gonzo and friends: Last night must have been quite a night. Camelot moments, mechanical marvels, Rustoleum launches, flying squirrels, fru-fru tea cuppers, V8 envy, Ensure catch cans -- and it wasn't even a full moon." -- SeattleTom


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