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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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PostPosted: April 6, 2021, 8:43 pm 
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IMHO (in big letters), you just took a big step backward for esthetics. Looks like you installed bushes on the UCA instead of sphericals so they have to operate on the same axis. If they are sphericals, there is no room between the flanges for them to move so they still would bind. The previous UCA was adjustable for caster and camber, had more room for a coilover with a better angle and didn’t bind. The vsusp is much worse than before from what I can tell from a pic. The camber curves are flat because the chart scale is huge to cover how far the RC travels in 4 degrees. I remember telling you that angle iron is not good to hang control arms off of. It tends to crack rather than bend. It’s also less esthetic. If you want help to figure this out again, I will be happy to do so. I considered not saying anything but I thought I should share my opinion. Not my money or my build so do whatever you want! :cheers:

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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 7:01 am 
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Miatav8,MstrASE,A&P,F wrote:
IMHO (in big letters), you just took a big step backward for esthetics. Looks like you installed bushes on the UCA instead of sphericals so they have to operate on the same axis. If they are sphericals, there is no room between the flanges for them to move so they still would bind. The previous UCA was adjustable for caster and camber, had more room for a coilover with a better angle and didn’t bind. The vsusp is much worse than before from what I can tell from a pic. The camber curves are flat because the chart scale is huge to cover how far the RC travels in 4 degrees. I remember telling you that angle iron is not good to hang control arms off of. It tends to crack rather than bend. It’s also less esthetic. If you want help to figure this out again, I will be happy to do so. I considered not saying anything but I thought I should share my opinion. Not my money or my build so do whatever you want! :cheers:


Yes I would welcome your input- always respected!

I just did a temporary setup with the bushings on the UCA- I will install heim joints today when they arrive. The angle iron was removed- I had went back over your post and that is one of the reasons I decided to redo it to get rid of the angle iron as well as esthetics.

New flanges will be used to mount for hangers. I will also plate the top of the lower to set the lower shock by the lower ball joint

I think you are looking at the old photo.

Tweeking the geometry is where I need the help badly.


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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 8:38 am 
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Thank you. Post a link to the vsusp (right click the bottom of the vsusp page address, copy, then paste in a post).

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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 11:08 am 
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http://vsusp.com/?tool=2d#0.8%26project ... _camber%7D


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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 2:04 pm 
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Parts arrived- set the parts roughly up.
Attachment:
IMG_1832.JPG
IMG_1832.JPG [ 124.89 KiB | Viewed 227 times ]

Attachment:
IMG_1833.JPG
IMG_1833.JPG [ 110.1 KiB | Viewed 227 times ]


Now I need to improve the geometry before I tack weld it.
Need to swap out the lower bushings for rod ends yet


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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 2:09 pm 
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The main change was to lower the ride height so the rear LCAP can mount above the frame rail with the LCA level, lengthening the LCA for a better ratio to the UCA which was shortened. This added about two inches to the front track. Probably need to switch back to the other UCA tubes to get the pivot axis to UBJ center dim correct.
Willis Locost 7

How did you determine your wheel offset?

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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 2:48 pm 
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The problem with lowering the ride height to 4" is that my pan hangs down almost 2" below the frame now.

that actually was from an earlier chart you had sent to e some time back I measured the offset just now 0.5".

To lengthen the LCAs I would have to start with new LCAs

Thom


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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 3:37 pm 
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I could lower the frame to 4.5" ride height and move the existing LCAs in by 2.75" and up to 1/75" above the frame bottom

This is the result

Willis Locost 7


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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 3:51 pm 
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This configuration will place the rear LCA mount just above the frame. The front will be mounted just outside the frame.

Thom


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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 3:57 pm 
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Look at this

Willis Locost 7


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PostPosted: April 7, 2021, 4:05 pm 
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The LCA legs can be lengthened by removing the spot welds and slotting the tube at the press fit unless they just slip in, which would make it really easy. Trim back to undamaged tube, insert a two inch long tube inside with one inch hanging out, then slip on new tubing that will be long enough once the bung is installed. You can buy the tube online from many sources in short lengths.

You can raise the engine in the chassis, change to larger tires, or simply live with it designed for larger tires and too low or preload the suspension for the clearance needed.

The rim is 7 inch so you have 4.5 inches measured from the rim mounting surface to the inboard tire retaining lip?

What is the rear track width (tire center to tire center)?

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PostPosted: April 8, 2021, 7:02 am 
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On the LCA mod, another alternative is to cut the tube to remove the bungs then chuck the cutoffs in a small metal lathe to part the tube. As for frame mods, I’d go back with DOM with a thicker wall than the cromo to make it easier to weld.

Here is what you can do to add LCA length without widening the track. The front track should be wider than the rear. The new rack position would be higher and or front mounted for LCAP clearance. As for ground clearance, the inner rail could be offset to be lower or higher with a few inches of overlap of the existing adjacent bay tube and gusseting or an offset bend in the adjacent bay.

Having the right tools is important to make the work much less difficult, dusty and noisy. You should have a handheld band saw (hbf is fine) along with an electric die grinder with 3 inch friction discs and arbor, a drill with a carbide rotary file (like a porting bit but to dress tube edges and openings) and a name brand angle grinder and grinding discs.

Once you make a final decision on the LCA length and angle and provide the final vsusp, we can adjust the UCA position and length to make the most of that compromise.


Attachments:
BostonWill frame.jpg
BostonWill frame.jpg [ 250.9 KiB | Viewed 153 times ]

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PostPosted: April 8, 2021, 9:15 am 
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So I think I have what will work now. It will require replacing the LCAs. But I an purchase these at a reasonable price.
Attachment:
Johnny Law Mustang II Medium Tubular IFS Lower Control Arms FORD - MUSTANG 2.jpg
Johnny Law Mustang II Medium Tubular IFS Lower Control Arms FORD - MUSTANG 2.jpg [ 82.26 KiB | Viewed 128 times ]


They have a 13" enter to enter length I will us the swedged uppers with the upper ball joint collar rings.

This will get a better configuration with the specifications lose to an original mustang II geometry. I will set the LCAs just above and on top of the bottom frame tubes.

I will lower the ground clearance to 5".

There are the specifications
Willis Locost 7

This I can deal with


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PostPosted: April 8, 2021, 12:54 pm 
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Without answers to the questions and based on the imposed limitations, this is the best balance I could come up with:

Willis Locost 7 mv8 04082021

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PostPosted: April 8, 2021, 1:01 pm 
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I think that works! Trying to make it work- not a prefect race car

Thanks Miatav8

Thom


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