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Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 7, 2017, 3:20 pm 
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Joined: February 8, 2014, 10:47 pm
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Location: Cornholio OR "Where the magic happens"
I would recommend using a MS2 rather than a Microsquirt.

A Microsquirt is not as flexible as a MS2 also a MS2 has more I/O capability than a Microsquirt.

Guys often say "I just want a basic system" which is code for I'm a cheap ass.

These guys often come back around in 6 months so happy with how a MS works then are asking how to make the microsquirt do the stuff a MS2 will do. Bzzzzzt! nope.

I see the same happen with PNP systems, at least they are somewhat more flexible though still lacking in I/O.

There are Break out kits that allow you to plug a MS2 into many factory harnesses but they have certain limitations.

The best option is Get the MS2 kit, or have me custom build one for you.

Only 21 wires to connect (not counting the grounds) and great support here http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=101

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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 7, 2017, 5:06 pm 
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I went with MS3X for my 5.0 M3 swap. The MS3 kit is $385 and the Microsquirt is $370. If you don't need the mild waterproofing or ultra compact size, I'd skip the Microsquirt. And to add the MS3X card is $105, so for under $500 you have 8+ cylinder sequential ignition and injection and a whole bunch of IO for traction control, launch control, oil/fuel pressure, multiple bank widebands, etc. etc. Is there another brand that can do that for under $1000?


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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 7, 2017, 5:55 pm 
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Location: Cornholio OR "Where the magic happens"
Is there another brand that can do that for under $2000?

TIFTFY

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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 7, 2017, 9:56 pm 
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Joined: August 8, 2014, 6:08 pm
Posts: 548
Location: Green Bay, WI
Lonnie-S wrote:
What was your experience level with electronics and fuel injection prior to starting this journey with Microsquirt? I'm just curious because of my own future choice that must be made. I have all my Ford Mustang ACU/harneses, sensors, etc., but was wondering if a simple aftermarket choice might be better for me in the long run. I'm at a low level of expertise with respect to electronics and EFI myself.

If you'r einexperienced, I'd be interested in how it has been for you.

Cheers,

Lonnie you have good questions. I have had zero electronics exposure till now. I feel like I am headed in the right direction, BUT, have not entered into the program mode very seriously yet. The manual does give you guidelines as to where most parameters work within to start you off. Until you throw spark to it you just don't know. Baby steps my friend.

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My build : viewtopic.php?f=35&t=17160


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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 7, 2017, 10:09 pm 
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Joined: August 8, 2014, 6:08 pm
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Location: Green Bay, WI
Bent Wrench wrote:
I would recommend using a MS2 rather than a Microsquirt.

A Microsquirt is not as flexible as a MS2 also a MS2 has more I/O capability than a Microsquirt.

Guys often say "I just want a basic system" which is code for I'm a cheap ass.

These guys often come back around in 6 months so happy with how a MS works then are asking how to make the microsquirt do the stuff a MS2 will do. Bzzzzzt! nope.

I see the same happen with PNP systems, at least they are somewhat more flexible though still lacking in I/O.

There are Break out kits that allow you to plug a MS2 into many factory harnesses but they have certain limitations.

The best option is Get the MS2 kit, or have me custom build one for you.

Only 21 wires to connect (not counting the grounds) and great support here http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=101

My only criteria when I talked to the guys as MS was to marry together the Ford and Mazda electrical I had because of my blend build and an open ended option for a turbo. This is where they pointed me. Oh one more, I am not soldering a pile of microscopic resistors to a board. So this does sequential spark if you want. The Ms2 board doesn't come ready for something I had here and you have to solder and jumper some stuff on. I am out on any of that. I really don't know enough about this stuff to hold my own in a good debate so I won't all I know is on the printed page of the manual (wish me luck). I have a really good buddy that only deals with FAST. you should see those prices. I think this will be just fine for what were doing here.

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My build : viewtopic.php?f=35&t=17160


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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 7, 2017, 11:15 pm 
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Joined: October 24, 2008, 2:13 pm
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Location: Carlsbad, California, USA
Thank you, Steve. I'll stay tuned with interest.

Cheers,

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Damn! That front slip angle is way too large and the Ackerman is just a muddle.

Build Log: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=5886


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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 7, 2017, 11:42 pm 
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Joined: December 24, 2007, 5:11 am
Posts: 690
Location: Seattle area
Steve and Lonnie,

When I made the decision to try a Mega Squirt I did have a very small amount of PrintedCircuitBoard experience. In the late '60s I put together a Heath kit metal detector. And it worked quite well. But as a refresher and to test long unused skills I bought another kit. Not Heath, they were long gone by then. This time a multi meter for about $20. It went well and gave me the confidence to tackle the MS.

Paul Harhen (known here as JPSEuropa) has put at least one MS together and is usually eager to help out a Locoster in need.

Good hunting guys.

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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 8, 2017, 7:59 am 
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Location: Connersville, Indiana
I really can't recommend older guys soldering one of these things together. At least the MS3. Back in the 70's, I assembled a few electronic kits and had no problems, so I figured the MS kit would be no big deal. It kicked my ass. I found that really small parts, some dumb PCB design and iffy instructions combined with my ignorance, declining vision and coordination produced a pile of junk. In all fairness, it seems the instructions have improved. I haven't.

My ultimate downfall was the discovery that when I used enough magnification to see what I was doing, my brain ignores my right eye, destroying 3D vision.

Bill


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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 8, 2017, 1:06 pm 
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Location: Green Bay, WI
BBlue wrote:
I really can't recommend older guys soldering one of these things together. At least the MS3. Back in the 70's, I assembled a few electronic kits and had no problems, so I figured the MS kit would be no big deal. It kicked my ass. I found that really small parts, some dumb PCB design and iffy instructions combined with my ignorance, declining vision and coordination produced a pile of junk. In all fairness, it seems the instructions have improved. I haven't.

My ultimate downfall was the discovery that when I used enough magnification to see what I was doing, my brain ignores my right eye, destroying 3D vision.

Bill

Thanks a big reason I went with the Microsquirt. They said it's same as MS2 and water resistant. MS told me if I had to pull the case apart add silicone and now its water proof.

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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 8, 2017, 2:41 pm 
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Joined: February 8, 2014, 10:47 pm
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Location: Cornholio OR "Where the magic happens"
An MS3 installs on a (preferred) v3.0 main board, there is actually less to build if you use the MS3X.

Circuit board work is not that bad if you have the right tools. 8)

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=desk+light+magnafying+glass


My issue with the pre-assembled stuff is it lacks flexibility.

Also a Microsquirt is NOT the same as an MS2.
You might call it an MS2 Jr. cause it's not all grown up yet.
It's missing a bunch of options. And most you can't add.

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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 8, 2017, 3:57 pm 
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Location: Seattle area
Bill is right. Did my MS almost 10 years ago. Couldn't do it now. Eyes have really degenerated in the last 5 or 6 years.

But if your eyes are up to it it can be fun an very rewarding.

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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 8, 2017, 6:00 pm 
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Joined: April 23, 2006, 8:26 pm
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reading glasses work great for that - as well as when welding.

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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 9, 2017, 7:47 am 
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Location: Connersville, Indiana
KB58 wrote:
reading glasses work great for that - as well as when welding.

No. I needed reading glasses, increased lighting, plus a magnifying glass mounted on a stand. That's when I lost my 3D vision. That led to some of the components sporting racing stripes. Not good. Still could not see well enough to determine if some of the connections, especially transistor, were bridged.

The designer of the PCB did nothing to increase distance between leads. I couldn't believe it. 40 years ago, PCB's when transistors were many times larger, leads were mounted onto the board in a triangular configuration. Easy peasy. Not so on the MS board. Three leads in line, in less than 1/4".

Bill


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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 9, 2017, 9:21 am 
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I'm an EE - I know all about that. Are there SMT parts also? They're doable for very few, impossible for most.

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 Post subject: Re: Tundra 7 442
PostPosted: August 9, 2017, 10:05 am 
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Location: Cornholio OR "Where the magic happens"
Not on a MS2 v3.0 main board.

Both the Microsquirt and the v3.57 main board are preassembled and use SMT


The most tricky soldering job on a MS2 is installing the jumper on the processor to enable the PE1 port (for those that need the extra digital input)

The next toughest solder job is the small transistors to avoid bridging. The rest is easy.

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