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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 4, 2020, 10:53 pm 
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davew wrote:
You do not need to think about "LOOKS BETTER" :o
You are probably going to end up with sound damping matl, on the engine side and carpet on the office side, to cut down the noise. That engine is right next to your ear! Davew


By looking better I mean it won't require painting or powder coating, rust or future maintenance.

I've been looking at sound proofing already. I'd love to sandwich some foam panels but I'd like one that doesn't put off poisonous fumes if the worst should happen and the car begins to burn with me in it. But so far I haven't found one.

Oh, and the solid panel is a no go. What I'd forgotten is that the firewall leans back and the roll bar is straight up and down. So using a solid panel outside and another inside mirroring that one ain't a gonna happen. Also I am sure the scrutineers are going to want to see the whole bar so I can't really cover it up like I wanted to.

In these pics the top is in place but the bottom is pushed back about 1/2" or more.

While I didn't think so when I was working on the car today, in these pics there just might be a way to attach some sort of sound proofing as long as it isn't any thicker than 1/2".

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On and aside while in the grocery store today I saw this. I thought it was a gag but the supplier was there and he laughed and said if it was a joke it was a good one because they sold more of that than any other of the flavored beers.


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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 4, 2020, 10:58 pm 
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Miatav8,MstrASE,A&P,F wrote:
Once you know the best length, just carry a spare. It is a tedious process with an auto tensioner, but I'd bring the alt back in and wrap a tape measure around the pulleys to get close to a correct length with the tensioner out of the way then add a few inches. Belts are usually identified by number of ribs (K6=6 rib) and length in inches.Buy a few belts 6 inches apart in length at an autoparts store, then zero in on the best length to provide enough tension with the tensioner released. There should be marks on the tensioner for the range it should be in. If the right range can't fit over the pulleys, you can try unbolting the alt on one side to pull it in for installing the belt while holding the tensioner back then wedge the alt back into position or make the alt mount adjustable. Don't actually need an auto tensioner with a flat belt but it is nice to have.


Looking at the placement today I realized that he did that to lower the alternator. In stock for it appears to fit near the top of the engine and stand proud of the top so I am betting it was also for body clearance.

I don't see a problem with it being where it is. Am I missing something?

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 4, 2020, 11:19 pm 
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I finally had time to do some work on the car today so I began looking at the pedals.

Here's a pic of my feet on the pedals and then one with my feet splayed so you can see the space between the pedal in relationship to feet size.

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feet splayed on pedals.jpg
feet splayed on pedals.jpg [ 138.32 KiB | Viewed 422 times ]


I'm thinking that offset pedals may be a much simpler solution than trying to move the pedal assembly. While I haven't had a chance to search for any yet, I'm thinking I've seen pictures showing optional pedals.

Here's the accelerator pedal attachment. At the very least the mounting point has to be built out about 2" to make all 3 pedals align. Fortunately, while it feels very solid, it isn't actually mounted yet so nothing to undo. I'm sure it's the pedal from the Impala. I've read the CTS pedal is the one to get as it's the most linear, but on my CTS it is very difficult to make minor movements. On my ATS it just feels much more natural so I may search for one of those before I mount it.

Attachment:
accel pedal mount.jpg
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Unless I were to raise all the pedals and the floor at that point to match the center tubes, moving it out over more to the center isn't a real option. I've driven cars with offset pedals and when you've got to do things quickly many times your feet hit the wrong pedal so I'd like to avoid that if possible.

But, while in theory the piece of wood shows you where the side of the tunnel console would go, I think that if I were to angle that side way towards the middle that would buy me a little more room and if I can find offset brake and clutch pedals I just might be able to have adequate room for the accel pedal without any major mods.

Here are some pics to show you the clearance issue I'll run into trying to move the pedals. I've got literally a finger's thickness of clearance between the clutch cylinder and a large round tube. Plus the gas tank is moved as far over to the passenger side as it can go. There's only about 1/4" clearance on the right side.


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cylinders at footwell.jpg
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side cylinders at footwell.jpg
side cylinders at footwell.jpg [ 81.99 KiB | Viewed 422 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 4, 2020, 11:29 pm 
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When I was under the car I realized the lowest point on the car for a good ways is the hard radiator lines running from the front to the rear. Imma thinking some sort of skid plate. Pics in another post.

But while under there it appeared that a drop floor pan would be an easy way to give me a little more head room and make ingress and egress a trifle easier.

I've got to see what size the Cobra dropped pans are, the only ones I've ever put in, but I know there are multiple drop pans out there.

My area is 18.25" X 45".

Attachment:
width of floor pan.jpg
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length of floor pan.jpg
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Attachment:
45 inches.jpg
45 inches.jpg [ 124.43 KiB | Viewed 421 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 4, 2020, 11:37 pm 
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Here are the hard water lines running from rad to engine in rear.

I guess the good thing is they aren't technically running through the cockpit heating it up.

Pics are front, mid and rear


Attachments:
front car.jpg
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mid car.jpg
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rear car.jpg
rear car.jpg [ 71.55 KiB | Viewed 421 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 4, 2020, 11:40 pm 
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I noticed that it has 2 psi brake line accumulators (I think that's what they are called).

One is located in the brake line that runs through the cockpit and the front is on a T right behind the fuel tank.

Now why would I need those?


Attachments:
front.jpg
front.jpg [ 90.76 KiB | Viewed 421 times ]
rear in cockpit.jpg
rear in cockpit.jpg [ 82.25 KiB | Viewed 421 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 4, 2020, 11:50 pm 
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It looks like rivnuts are in my immediate future.

When I got to looking it appears he drilled the holes while working around the roll bar and the holes aren't exactly the same size or shape.

Attachment:
weird holes.jpg
weird holes.jpg [ 96.14 KiB | Viewed 419 times ]


Since I won't be replacing the whole firewall that means I'll need to make a patch to cover the cut outs where the old roll bar was and then there's this opening above it right behind my head. I definitely want a fire block there!!

Now to start my internet searches for pedals & drop pans.


Attachments:
firewall holes.jpg
firewall holes.jpg [ 120.46 KiB | Viewed 419 times ]
inside rear.jpg
inside rear.jpg [ 92.14 KiB | Viewed 419 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 5, 2020, 9:24 am 
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Whooa!!! That is going to be a lot of work to seal off the engine bay fire wall area, to be able to pass tech. I did not realize how much of your inner body was cut out. I had a small ledge, that the rear roll bar loop passed thru. It was relatively easy to seal off. davew


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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 5, 2020, 9:33 am 
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You have a ton of work to do. I'd start with the pedals. You would need to make the offset pedals but it would be much better to move the assembly up a couple inches to put the ball of your foot on the T in tilton and provide clearance between the steering and the outboard brake master when moving the assembly outboard one inch.

To lower the floor, buy a sheet of .050" steel, 2x4s and lots of c clamps. Use a 2 foot 2x4 as a hammer for bending. Have moly sheetmetal cutters for left and right cuts (red and green handles). Spring for the compound type cutters for less distortion. If you don't have much welding experience, go with thicker sheet such as .080 but it will be harder to work with and cut. The screws will loosen eventually with the cutters. Just retighten and they will cut forever. Must be moly blades. If you don't have the hand strength, use a sawzall where a band saw won't reach.

I'd go to tractorsupply and get a bag of 1/4-20 x 1 and 1.5 bolts, 3/8 bolts same length, and find the best fitting washers for both. Don't just buy the size that says 1/4 or 3/8 because the fit can be very loose. Also get lock washers and nuts. They have grade 2 and 5. Grade 2 is fine most of the time. Depends on what you are trying to do.

The belt picture doesn't show everything. Squeeze the belt together with your hands between the alt and tensioner and watch the pulley. If you see the pulley location moving inboard/deflecting, the mount needs some work.


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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 5, 2020, 9:34 am 
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carguy123 wrote:
I noticed that it has 2 psi brake line accumulators (I think that's what they are called).

One is located in the brake line that runs through the cockpit and the front is on a T right behind the fuel tank.

Now why would I need those?


If the reservoirs are as high as the calipers, you do not need or want those.

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 5, 2020, 2:40 pm 
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Thanks for the advice guys.

Miatav8 I hadn't thought about Tractor Supply. I immediately went to to Amazon. I also have an Atwood's Farm & Tractor supply near me and they have a good selection too.

Unfortunately I don't have 2" to move the pedals forward. The steering rack and the steering shaft get in the way.

Attachment:
not much room to move.jpg
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If you are worried about the placement of my feet on the pedals, I have tons of space lengthwise to place them elsewhere. I was just covering the pedals to illustrate how they covered up the accel pedal. I have room to the left of the pedals so shifting the pedals with an offset gives me the room I need for the accel and still leaves me room for a dead pedal. But I still have a lot of holes to cover up to seal the front end even if that does work.

Yes, DaveW the firewall is really the biggest issue and since the car is mostly together it is going to require quite a bit of disassembly. While I don't anticipate a fire since I have gas tank in front and gas lines exiting just past my right elbow and then the fuel filter and pressure regulator right behind the seat I'd like a nice and tight seal.

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 5, 2020, 2:45 pm 
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While I don't need it to be able to place my feet properly on the pedals, raising the whole pedal assembly does give me the option of more room on my right for the gas pedal since I could then put my foot on the central tubing.

With a drop pan that also rotates the seat front upwards a little and won't make it an awkward leg & foot placement. F1 drivers have their feet much higher in the air.

I've got grand daughter coming over today and we have to go buy her a fancy dress for a Father-daughter dance I'm going to take her to. Her dad will be there, but he's catering it for the city so he won't be able to dance with her.

I'm still going to try to squeeze some time in to work and probably tear a little further apart to see if some other options jump out at me.

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 5, 2020, 3:43 pm 
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I was not suggesting forward or backward, just up one or two inches as needed to clear the rack enough to move the assembly over one inch for more throttle pedal access. Another pic for clarity but just one way to do it.

If you have plenty of leg room with padded seats installed, then moving the masters aft 2 inches and fitting banjos would allow you to move things around without hitting the rack or steering intermediate shaft.


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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 6, 2020, 1:36 am 
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carguy123 wrote:
I noticed that it has 2 psi brake line accumulators (I think that's what they are called).

One is located in the brake line that runs through the cockpit and the front is on a T right behind the fuel tank.

Now why would I need those?


Residual Brake Pressure Valves are often installed when either the calipers or the wheel cylinders/drum brakes have a design or springs in them that are strong enough to push too much hydraulic fluid back towards the master cylinder resulting in a spongy brake pedal.

When required, 2 psi RBPVs are typically installed between disk brake calipers and the master cylinder while 10 psi RBPVs are typically installed between drum brakes and the master cylinder.

I'd guess that if someone went to the trouble of installing RBPVs in your braking system there's a good chance that you need them. Good luck, Bill

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 Post subject: Re: Kelmarkish
PostPosted: January 6, 2020, 9:42 am 
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More suggestions :D
With the long runs in the water lines to the front, you could have cooling issues cause by cavitation.
That long column of water has a lot of mass. The water pump can not quickly move it, which leads to cavitation. You may need a 2nd source of water for the water pump. I had to install a 2qt remote reservoir that plumed into the water pump inlet side. a 2nd hose ran from the top of the tank over to the out let side of the engine thermostat neck to complete loop in the cooling system. Both hoses where heater hose size. My tank was mounted high enough that I could use it as a header tank with a rad cap.
The other thing you are going to find out, is the Kelmark body is very efficient wing with a flat core bottom. I would start with a body rake of a min of 1 1/2" and in all probability you will end up with more. Also any speed greater than 130MPH you are going to need a front air dam. Davew


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