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 Post subject: Re: Duratec 2.3 & OBD II
PostPosted: April 19, 2017, 6:14 am 
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Location: Connersville, Indiana
Driven5 wrote:
I believe the Fusion uses the Mazda version of the engine, which has intake cam variable timing, which is less well supported in the aftermarket and might (or might not?) add some complexity...Well, more technically correct would be to say that the Focus (and Ranger) use a Ford variation* of the Mazda developed engine.



*cheapened

The main reason the VVT has not enjoyed much support is due to the fact no one has been able to use it to find significant hp gains. It seems Ford designed the engine for high performance with the cam in the stationary default position and used the VVT to "civilize" the engine. One guy spent a weekend with the engine on the dyno looking for the VVT hp key, finally threw in the towel and disconnected the VVT. Maybe in a fully "built" engine.

Bill


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 Post subject: Re: Duratec 2.3 & OBD II
PostPosted: April 19, 2017, 10:37 am 
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BBlue wrote:
It seems Mazda designed the engine for high performance with the cam in the stationary default position and used the VVT to "civilize" the engine.
FTFY. :wink:

Although I'm also not sure I buy that the reason for there being less support for the Mazdas is simply because there are no significant gains available in altering the timing of the stock cam, since the same could be said of the non-VCT Fords as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Duratec 2.3 & OBD II
PostPosted: April 19, 2017, 11:46 am 
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Currently sourcing the rest of the parts and bugging Marcus and the other Car9 aficionados. Build log to follow. Thanks again!


Hi Lee, glad to hear it! Getting a log started soon would be a help for me to start sharing drawings and other plans. I know I need to update my website, but that is a bigger job and I don't want details about that to slow you down at all. If you have a log it helps me to keep things organized with your changes in a place I can find them.

I think it would be nice if Tuck would start the build log, it can be part of what he presents for his project at school. Drawings and plans and discussions with adults ( or at least what passes for adults on this forum :rofl: ) will put things in context and add a lot for him. That way if he doesn't have something finished welded or makes a little less progress than intended, I don't think it will count against him.

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 Post subject: Re: Duratec 2.3 & OBD II
PostPosted: April 20, 2017, 9:09 am 
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Joined: February 28, 2009, 11:09 pm
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Location: Connersville, Indiana
Driven5 wrote:
BBlue wrote:
It seems Mazda designed the engine for high performance with the cam in the stationary default position and used the VVT to "civilize" the engine.
FTFY. :wink:

Although I'm also not sure I buy that the reason for there being less support for the Mazdas is simply because there are no significant gains available in altering the timing of the stock cam, since the same could be said of the non-VCT Fords as well.

My intent was to point out the fact there is no need to view VVT in Fords (not familiar with the Mazda version) as a complication or be concerned about the lack of support. Just ignore the VVT. Should have said that. Your comment about support for the Mazdas and non-VCT Fords confuses me.

Probably should give it all a rest.

Bill


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 Post subject: Re: Duratec 2.3 & OBD II
PostPosted: April 20, 2017, 10:49 am 
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BBlue wrote:
My intent was to point out the fact there is no need to view VVT in Fords (not familiar with the Mazda version) as a complication or be concerned about the lack of support. Just ignore the VVT. Should have said that. Your comment about support for the Mazdas and non-VCT Fords confuses me.

Fair enough. If you're familiar with VCT Fords, then you're also going to be pretty familiar with the Mazdas, as Ford didn't change much on the engine itself when they 'borrowed' the Mazda VCT engines for their cars. You can drop the Ford engines into Mazda cars with relatively little effort. It seems to me that implementing the VCT vs non-VCT has a few possible trade-off's, depending on application and implementation, but absolutely agree that there shouldn't really be any deal breakers one way or the other for most of our purposes. What I was getting at was more that at least it used to be that the non-VCT engines had both aftermarket parts and OEM-ECU tuning options that were not directly compatible or readily available for use on the VCT engines. Admittedly it also easily could have largely changed since I last paid much attention to such things.

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Last edited by Driven5 on April 20, 2017, 11:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Duratec 2.3 & OBD II
PostPosted: April 20, 2017, 11:15 am 
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"That's all I meant, and admittedly it all could have changed since I last paid any attention to such things as well."

It's my understanding that Mazda dropped the Duratec program altogether a couple of years ago. Its a confusing, complex, ever changing world we live in.

Bill


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 Post subject: Re: Duratec 2.3 & OBD II
PostPosted: April 20, 2017, 11:40 am 
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The Mazda L-Engine (Mazda MZR/Ford Duratec) development diverged around 2012 when Ford came out with their Ti-VCT Duratec engine for the 2012 Focus while Mazda came out with their Skyactiv-G engine family. So yeah, all a part of the cycle of marriages, divorces, and flings that permeate the automotive industry almost as badly as Hollywood. Most of what we'd be looking at and talking about predates that particular break-up though.

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Also follow my build on blogspot, tumblr, or instagram and twitter (GarageOdyssey)


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