LocostUSA.com

Learning how to build Lotus Seven replicas...together!
It is currently Fri May 24, 2013 4:15 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 3:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 3:18 pm
Posts: 5
I've been reading and learning a bunch from this site. I started looking around to see if there were any Thunderbird rear ends locally I could purchase as I start to collect parts. I did actually find one! BUT it is from a 2002 Thunderbird. Everything I read is about the older models, and I can't find anything about the newer ones. Would they work?

Here are the specs: (only $250!)

3.58:1 Ratio, sub frame, differential, axles, hubs, 11.3" disc brakes with E-brakes, calipers, NO SPRINGS

What do you think? (the assembly is about 2 hours from me, so I don't want to drive all the way down there for nothing!)

Attachment:
File comment: Picture of complete assembly
assembly.jpg
assembly.jpg [ 11.08 KiB | Viewed 620 times ]

Attachment:
File comment: Close-up
inner.jpg
inner.jpg [ 11.17 KiB | Viewed 620 times ]


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2009 9:36 pm
Posts: 992
Location: meadview arizona
thats the point of building a car yourself, make it fit.

_________________
i see you stand like greyhounds in the slips straining upon the start, the games afoot, follow your spirit.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 5:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 3:18 pm
Posts: 5
john hennessy wrote:
thats the point of building a car yourself, make it fit.


True, however since I've never tackled anything like this before (I'm a software developer), I'd rather attempt to do something that has been tried and tested. I'm just a little concerned since I have not found anything on any site regarding these differentials. It makes me wonder if there is something that prevents them from working well or if they simply require way more work then I can do.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 5:32 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:06 pm
Posts: 1725
Location: Under the weather. (Seattle)
Sure just about anything can work, including those DEW98 ("new" Thunderbird, LS, S-Type) chassis components. That's definitely a pretty attractive price. I'm not sure what differential is in them, but I am pretty certain it's not the 8.8 IRS most people are familiar with from the MN12 chassis cars. As such, there may or may not be a limited slip readily available if you require one for your build. While they both use a 5x108 wheel pattern, the MN12 has the option to swap hubs to those from an IRS Mustang Cobra to convert to 5x114.3 which substantially broadens wheel availability. Whether or not anything similar can be done with the DEW98 components is open open to research and debate, but ultimately will require somebody with a vested interest hunting down the facts. As a starting point it appears the wheel bearings might share a common ID with the MN12 (just wider?) and the CV axles look to use a 28 tooth spline like the MN12...So maybe there is some potential there.

_________________
-Justin

Also follow my build on blogspot, tumblr, or twitter (@GarageOdyssey)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:15 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 3:18 pm
Posts: 5
I've been scouring the internet all day trying to find information on this diff. I finally just found a site that says the new Thunderbirds use a Ford 8.0" IRS differential. I did want LSD, and I was able to find one that would work, but I also read posts that indicated some 2002 Thunderbirds did come with a LSD. (which I do want for sure)

Here is what I found out about the differential:

• Ring Gear Diameter: 8.000
• Cover Bolts: 10
• Ring Gear Bolts: 10
• Spline Count: 28
• Dropout: False
• Pinion Support: False
• Carrier Breaks: none
• Rear Suspension: Independent

It looks like the differential won't be as strong as the 8.8", but should be stronger then the 7.5". I'm leaning towards using an LSX motor, so I'm not sure if it would be quite strong enough...


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:23 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 27, 2010 1:11 pm
Posts: 60
Location: Cuba, MO
Another thing to consider is the overall width, wms-wms. Are there shorter axles that can be swapped in to reduce the overall width. That is the problem with the MN12 diff, the overall width is too wide for anything but a +4.

Were you planning on using the subframe as well? I cant see how the spindle looks in the pictures, but those arms look very light.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 3:18 pm
Posts: 5
I was thinking about using the whole subframe. But the more I've read about that 8.0" differential, the more I think I better pass on it.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 5:38 pm 
Offline
The voice of reason
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 4:47 pm
Posts: 5033
Location: Massachusetts
Quote:
But the more I've read about that 8.0" differential, the more I think I better pass on it.


Please elaborate and share what you learn. Personally, I think even the 7.5" is strong enough. In our case the limiting factor is probably much more the torque available at the rear wheels then the torque available from the motor. They have to balance each other. That would be for "normal" use anyway. If you're building it for use just at the drag strip, things might be different...

I don't think building that sub frame into your car is a good idea. It will weigh a lot and then you have a suspension designed for a car 3 times your weight with a bunch of bump steer. I don't think it will save you much effort either.

_________________
Marcus Barrow - Designer of Car9, an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 7:15 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:09 pm
Posts: 720
horizenjob wrote:
Quote:
But the more I've read about that 8.0" differential, the more I think I better pass on it.


Please elaborate and share what you learn. Personally, I think even the 7.5" is strong enough. In our case the limiting factor is probably much more the torque available at the rear wheels then the torque available from the motor. They have to balance each other. That would be for "normal" use anyway. If you're building it for use just at the drag strip, things might be different...


Along this line, a few years ago I read that the Ford 8" (I'm sure it is not related to this 8", but size is certainly similar) was suitable for street use (no slicks) in an under 3,000 lb car regardless of engine size. Just not enough traction to do it in. Does this unit have a glaring weakness?

Bill


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:01 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 3:18 pm
Posts: 5
This Ford 8" is completely different then the Ford 8" of the past. It is called the Ford 8.0"IRS. I was unable to find any gears or limited slip for it. So you get what you get and you can't change it.

Also, since this setup was only used for a few years, I was unable to find anything that would lead me to believe the axles could be changed out to use different tires.


Those two items turned me off from it. It might work for others, but not for my plans.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Newer Thunderbird Differentials? (2002-2005)
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:15 am 
Offline
The voice of reason
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 4:47 pm
Posts: 5033
Location: Massachusetts
Well that's interesting. It's a big subject....

_________________
Marcus Barrow - Designer of Car9, an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group