Rust_Bucket's FlyW8 1.8L Miata Based Build

[sevenesqueron]

The suspense is killing us We're rooting for you.

Actually I didn't realize that injectors could get plugged up sitting around for a couple of years. Rats, I've got a box of what I thought were spare injectors. But they've been sitting around for who knows how long so maybe they're all toast. At least I won't be surprised if I go to use one or more and find they don't work.

Ron

[rust_bucket]

I didn't realize that injectors could get plugged up sitting around for a couple of years.
Ron

You and me both!
I figure I have nothing to lose by trying to clean them. - I'm guessing somewhere on the great internet of knowledge someone has some tips on how to do it. (Or statements such as "Forget about it, once they're pugged, they're plugged.")
- In fact I'll bet there are a few on this forum who know quite a bit about plugged injectors. - I'll just sit back and wait to see what trickles in...
- Best price I could find was a rebuilt set on eBay at around $160 a set plus core charges. - New from various sources range from $90-$300 a piece, OUCH!

[davew]

Rust bucket

Search for a local shop that can clean your injectors. I only paid $60 to get my injectors clean and flow checked. There are several shops in S.E. Michigan, you could alway mail them if you can not find anything in TU.

Dave W

[junior]

You can clean them yourself with some injector cleaner, a rubber hose, two alligator clips, and your battery to apply 12v and the ground. I had two really jacked injectors and got them all cleaned up in no time.

J. R.

[nether10]

You can clean them yourself with some injector cleaner, a rubber hose, two alligator clips, and your battery to apply 12v and the ground. I had two really jacked injectors and got them all cleaned up in no time.

Have a link to instructions, or care to give us a tutorial? Sounds like some good knowledge to have!

[rust_bucket]

Good and bad news from the injector front, I pulled them out and jumped the leads. All of them have plenty of clicky clicky going on. I shot them up the best I could with some cleaner. Like you say JR I need to rig up something where I can get some pressure behind them and then jump the leads to see if they are spraying. - I also need to check their resistivity. The manual I have says they can sound like they're functioning well but if the resistance is wrong they aren't. - Problem is I still need to find my multi-meter. It's been so long since I used it I don't know where it is.
The bad news I guess is that I still don't really know what's preventing the start. I was kind of hoping it was the injectors so I would at least know what was malfunctioning.
I'll keep digging. Argh.

In the mean time I fabbed up the fan mounts I've been putting off for a long time. The fan is a little on the large side, It's left-over from an old Ford truck I had, but it will work and it's free. I'll post pics when I get a chance.

[reddeth]

I need to rig up something where I can get some pressure behind them

Call around to some local hot rodding shops, they will probably know of a local performance shop that can bench test the injectors (if they can't themselves). It should be easy to track one down, especially if you live in a large town.

I did this when I rebuilt the engine and transmission on my 96 Impala SS. Cost about $55 to do all 8, they cleaned and flow tested all the injectors, found out one should be replaced, and I walked away with a nice squeaky clean set of flow tested injectors. Worth every penny in my book.

Just an option.

[junior]

You can clean them yourself with some injector cleaner, a rubber hose, two alligator clips, and your battery to apply 12v and the ground. I had two really jacked injectors and got them all cleaned up in no time.

Have a link to instructions, or care to give us a tutorial? Sounds like some good knowledge to have!

I followed a tutorial on this about 4 years ago. I will do some google searching and see what I can come up with, but basically you put a long tube on the top of the injector. Fill it with injector cleaner. Before this though you let the injector soak all night long in the stuff. Then you use a bike pump and put some pressure on the injector cleaner in the hose. Then you give voltage to the injector for very quick spirts so you don't over load it. I did this method on two injectors running the stuff through twice and they went from clogged, to a terrible spray, to a perfect mist.

The cost...... $0.00 I had the injector cleaner already and everything else was things at home.

Rusty. Check your PM's
Also, Harbor Freight has there multimeters on sale for $2.99 now. And they now are back-lit They are really nice.

J. R.

[junior]

The stock 1.6L miata uses 233cc injectors I think.

In case you have to buy new injectors:

"
The Miata uses high ohm injectors. Also know as saturated injectors.
Complete list of Miata plug and play replacement injectors (“F” connector):

Code:

Year Make/Model Engine Size/Color Part #
87-88 Toyota MR2 4AGE NA 213cc – Beige Top #23250-16080
89-91 B2220 Truck 224cc - Yellow Top? #23250-74040?
99-00 Mazda Miata 240cc - Thin Red Body #195500-4430
Toyota 4AGE 250cc – Green Top
Toyota 4AGE 250cc – Violet Top
94-97 Mazda Miata 265cc - Tan Top #195500-2180
01-06 Mazda Miata 265cc - Thin Lt. Prple #195500-4060
Toyota 3SGE 295cc – Green Top
89-92 Toyota Supra 7MGE NA 305cc – LT Green Top #23250-70080
93-95 Toyota Supra 3.0L 312cc - Maroon Top #23250-46030
Toyota 3SGE 315cc – Pink Top
90-92 MX6/626/Probe Turbo 326cc - Gray Top #195500-2150
89-91 B2600 Truck 326cc - Gray Top #195500-2150
Mazda 323 GTX TURBO 360cc - Black Top #195500-2130
Celica/MR2 3SGE NA 370cc - Green Top #23250-74160
Mazda RX8 420cc - Yellow Body #195500-4450
89-92 Mazda RX-7 NA 440cc - Blue Top #195500-5740
89-91 RX-7 NA 460cc - Red Top #195500-2010
89-91 RX-7 TURBO 550cc - purple top #195500-2020

The same connector shape can be found on low ohm injectors, but they require wiring in resistors to increase the resistance and filing down the tabs on the sides of the injectors.
Direct fit LOW OHM injectors (“E” connector):

89-92 Toyota Supra (7MGE) NA - (295cc – Yellow Top) - #23250-70040
88-91 Toyota Collora GT-S Turbo (4AGZE) – (365cc – Red-Orange Top)
92-95 Toyota Collora GT-S TURBO (4AGZE) – (365cc – Red-Orange Top)
86-92 Toyota Supra (7MGTE) TURBO – (430cc – Black Top)
Toyota MR2 (3SGTE) TURBO – (430cc – Black Top)"


J. R.

[rust_bucket]

It's ALIVE!!!



(Like you didn't see that coming...)

It's about time I get to write this post. It is officially alive. I finally figured out what was going on.
I had pressure in the line
spark at the plug
it would run on carb cleaner
signal to the injectors
clean and free-flowing injectors
EVERYTHING to the recipe right!?

It was the ol' double whammy. The reason it wouldn't start at first was that I didn't have the tach hooked up. About the same time I read the injector signal is timed through the tach I also read in my manual that the "rear-most fuel line is the supply side which runs directly into the FPR , then into the rail" so - I hooked up the tach and switched the lines. which netted the same result. So I cleaned the injectors using the above suggested method (which was actully pretty slick, thanks JR) I primed them then hooked it all back up. I primed the pump (again) and I was SURE it was going to turn over this time. Still NOTHING. I was getting pissed! Then I got looking at the fuel rail, this is the first FI system I have really played with, I'm kind of a carburator man... but I realized there was no way the injectors were seeing the right pressure. On this setup the supply goes directly into the rail then from the other end the FPR bleeds off what isn't used and flows it back to the tank, so I DID have the fuel lines hooked up right the FIRST time.
So tach and fuel routing were my real culprits. Each one disguising the other.

But I got it nailed down now.
It was about 11:00 and I wasn't about to let some silly 'noise ordinance' keep me down, no sir! I wrapped it up good! I filled the garage and cul-de-sac with gobs of stale oily uncatalyzed exhaust and it was about the sweetest smell I've ever known. I didn't run it long, but it was glorious. There was lots of hooting and hollering. My wife probably thinks I'm crazy. (Wait, she KNOWS I'm crazy.
Thanks all for the encouragement and ample coaching through my investigation guys.
Yah hoo. I'm pumped. - A drive line and some brake flex lines plus a few days of work and I might be able to go for a spin!

[nether10]

[GonzoRacer]

Yo, Rusty!
Way to go, Bro!!!! That's ultimo cool news! My hat's off to ya...
Any day now we'll be seeing a test drive video.
Congrats
JD

[davew]

Rusty that's great, I bet that there was a BIG smile that will last a week from making this milestone.

Congrats Dave W

[rx7locost]

Way to go.

You da MAN!!!

It's Miller time

Chuck

[Blackbird]

Congrats, man!

I also need to check their resistivity. The manual I have says they can sound like they're functioning well but if the resistance is wrong they aren't.

Just FYI, the vast majority of resistance checks suggested in Mazda's shop manual are completely worthless, so don't pay too much attention to them.

Moti