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Hello everyone!

Im a shop teacher at a local high school in NY and we have embarked on a BEC Locust build.
We have currently completed most of a basic frame and have completed the rear suspension architecture. (Waiting for tophats to mount struts).
Rear diff is currently mounted.

We have full automotive and metal shops on premises.

I have two issues that I need help with.

Ive decided to build a starter style electric reverse, but I havent found any data on ring gears and starters.
I basically need a ring gear about 6-7" in diameter and a corresponding starter. I would prefer to use as strong a starter as possible for obvious reasons, but need a ring gear to match. I even have several starters laying around the shop, but cannot source smaller ring gears with the same pitches... Anyone have a source for properly sized ring gears or data on matching starters/ring gears?

Other issue - I have decided to machine an adapter to mate the original sprocket to the driveshaft, but Im just a little worried about welding to a section of the driveshaft. It is a Subaru driveshaft that has a sliding joint as well as two universals (one by the motor, and one by the diff). The sliding joint is mid shaft. Machining the the driveshaft has proven very difficult and Im worried I wont be able to weld a flange to the driveshaft straight. Has anyone attempted this on their own?

Any help is greatly appreciated!

Danny

Welcome aboard Danny.. I'm an English/History teacher.. wanna trade?!? Sorry I don't have a starter/ring gear for you...


...I basically need a ring gear about 6-7" in diameter and a corresponding starter...


..I'm in the same boat.. I'm hopeful one of the guys will chime in with a source/part #/ or some success they've had- this is an awesome group.. they'll keep you from having to reinvent the wheel

Good luck with the project.

-ccrunner

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Dean

1972 Honda N600 Restomod "ccrunner's N600 VFR800 repower"

1963 Volvo P1800 Restomod
http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=16309

1959 Berkeley SE492 Restomod...
viewtopic.php?f=36&t=19397

"ccrunner's 1960 MGA coupe Restomod" found on MGExp.com

There's a thread http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=12045&hilit=electric+reverse that has an entry about using a Honda gx390 flywheel and starter about 1/2 way down the first page. ..
Here's a ring gear for a Briggs pretty cheap. http://tinyurl.com/ring-gear-on-ebay

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"There are times when a broken tool is better than a sound one, or a twisted personality more useful than a whole one.
For instance, a whole beer bottle isn't half the weapon that half a beer bottle is ..." Randall Garrett

Thanks for the replies guys - ccrunner, I wouldnt trade my job with any other teacher

oldejack, I have read that as I have done some extensive searching. I guess Im hoping to find something with a little more juice than a starter from a 13hp motor. I think the link for the ring and starter gears would work very well, but I am worried about the overall ring gear diameter. There are no dimensions listed! I wonder if I can find a local briggs dealer who might have parts?

How about making a gear? Should be educational for someone...

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Marcus Barrow - Car9 an open design community supported sports car for home builders!
SketchUp collection for LocostUSA: "Dream it, Build it, Drive it!"
Car9 Roadster information - models, drawings, resources etc.

this will give you pitch and tooth count for several automotive ring gears http://www.ringgearindia.com/docs/products.asp
The Briggs starter shows as 16 tooth on a 1.598" OD gear. ..

_________________
"There are times when a broken tool is better than a sound one, or a twisted personality more useful than a whole one.
For instance, a whole beer bottle isn't half the weapon that half a beer bottle is ..." Randall Garrett

Good source Jack.. I was just over there and the smallest ring gear I could dig out was from an Opel, 135 tooth (I didn't note the pitch), 228mm OD (aprox 9")..

I went digging a bit more for the ring gear/starter combo in the linked thread above, and was in fact able to find the Honda GX390 flywheel (must be about 6" diam?- looks like a good fit by the pics..), but I could not find a denso/nippondenso starter # BB586.. I did find a denso starter xxxxx-586, which might be the correct one- just not sure.. At any rate, still digging and looking for a light 'flexplate' like setup that can be driven by a small, light starter/ winch..

_________________
Dean

1972 Honda N600 Restomod "ccrunner's N600 VFR800 repower"

1963 Volvo P1800 Restomod
http://locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=16309

1959 Berkeley SE492 Restomod...
viewtopic.php?f=36&t=19397

"ccrunner's 1960 MGA coupe Restomod" found on MGExp.com

I'm thinking its awful close to a 10 pitch (tpi as in teeth per inch?) on the Briggs flywheel so a Dodge or Mitsu starter should do the trick or be reeaaaal close.
Might need to shave the tooth profile a little. ..

edit..
A pretty safe way of testing I think. ..
Mount the flywheel on a lathe and the starter on the tool rest so the gears can engage if the solenoid is activated.
Activate the solenoid, but not the motor itself, and start up the lathe at its lowest speed.
Let it run a few minutes and if theres enough misalignment to cause a problem it will show up at a lower and safer speed in a controllable environment.

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"There are times when a broken tool is better than a sound one, or a twisted personality more useful than a whole one.
For instance, a whole beer bottle isn't half the weapon that half a beer bottle is ..." Randall Garrett

Hehe - dont exactly remember what I wrote here, but I ordered the B&S ring gear and starter gear.

The ring gear seems to be approx 6.5" in diameter meaning it will fit in the tranny tunnel. I have a mitsu starter I can grab to test the tooth profile with. If its not correct, I will simply machine whatever I need to for the B&S starter gear to fit on an automotive starter.

Jack, I dont have a B&S starter, but I might have a few random 2 cycle snowthrower starters. Im going to do what I can and then I'll post back up!

Very interesting! I also would like to find a lightweight & compact reverse solution for my R1 based build. I have considered the reverse boxes, but I don't really like the idea of adding yet another set of gears along with the associated driveline losses and added potential point of failure under spirited driving into the mix.

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.. in the world

Whoa! A glitch! My reply somehow got up there (two posts back) as an edit of the OP's most recent post. Dunno what happened there. gto7419, you need to re-post that I think, or edit it back to how it was. So here's what I was trying to say, under my own name:

> I wonder if the starter gear is steel or alum. If its steel, I can simply machine it or an adapter onto an automotive starter and
> weld the assembly onto the starter. We'll find out soon!

It's a safe wager it's steel, and before you throw the B&S starter motor away, give it a try as is. You may not need as much power as you're thinking.

BTW, what you've found is better than any of the stuff I've found (I've been lookin' for ya) and we're all going to be very interested in the results.

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Locost builder and adventurer, and founder (but no longer owner) of Kinetic Vehicles

Don't forget that you have to have the shaft balanced once it's built. In that case it might be better in the long run to have a drive shaft shop do the whole job.

_________________
"My junk is organized. At least is was when I put it wherever it is." -olrowdy
Completed building GSXR1000 CMC7, "Locouki"
Website: http://projekt.com/locouki/

I've been debating just dropping the thing off, but wheres the fun in that?

On another note, the B&S ring gear came in. Its overall diameter is 8 3/16" and not the 6.5" that was advertised

Im still going to see if it mates up to the mitsu starter and if I can fit it in the car.

I am very disappointed in the ring gear though - its way too large, its cast alum and not steel, and the starter gear that comes with it is plastic...

Im still not convinced that it wont work, just not what I wanted and it looks like its going to be way more work because of its shape and size.

True, but how many people make there own rims or tires?

I usually figure critical things that rotate real fast (like 6000 rpm drive shafts next to my body parts) and some steering parts maybe ought to be left to certified welders or fabricators.

Anyway,
Here's a link to an old thread where we were writing about electric reverse. Down the page you'll come to some photos I posted of a red frame using a gear and how the guy arranged for the starter (although it looks more like a wheel chair motor I have) pinion to engage the larger gear.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=4879&hilit=reverse

In another thread I mentioned that I had found some small scooters at a local junk yard that had a gear about 6 or 7" in diameter with an electric starter (with a Bendix) to start the scooter motor. If I remember correctly the gear was mounted on the backside of the clutch so I couldn't see how it was attached (welded? bolted?).

With luck you might be able to adapt the scooter large gear to your drive shaft and the Bendix to a geared starter motor from an imported car. Or if necessary, cut away the electrical motor parts of the scooter starter leaving the Bendix and the shaft/bearings it's mounted on and couple that to a geared starter motor from an imported car. Since it would all be hidden inside the tunnel it would be strange looking but unseen.

_________________
"My junk is organized. At least is was when I put it wherever it is." -olrowdy
Completed building GSXR1000 CMC7, "Locouki"
Website: http://projekt.com/locouki/

The driveshaft is from a subaru and was balanced at the factory. Im adding one flange between the driveshaft and the engine sprocket, and sandwiching a gear between the rear and tail section of the driveshaft. That being said, I bought rims and tires

Thanks for the links - I have seen those posts - Im trying to achieve something similar to the red framed starter - albeit with some different parts because I simply cannot find a gear that small.
I live in woodmere ny (long island) - there arent too many junk yards around here to go junk scooter shopping - and the local junk yards are not like the pick and pulls many of you guys are used to. The junk yards around here make you wait at a desk while they pick up your part from the yard.